nisus.com

Two things:
First thing. Space before paragraph does not work after a break of any kind and at document start. I want each heading in my document to be below top margin by a given amount – typically 30 points. That is why Heading 1, in my case, has space "Before" set to 30. But space before a paragraph is not taken into account, that is it becomes zero, when the heading thereof comes right after a break. Now when I hand the file over to a Word, or OpenOffice, or NeoOffice, or what-have-you user, the heading shifts below the margin by 30 actual points, therefore bringing about a striking change in the way text and images are laid out. What prevents Nisus from adding a tiny, unobtrusive checkbox (is it the name?) in "Paragraph" palette, allowing one to activate or not spacing after breaks too? Mellel has a that option, and Mellel is not centuries ahead.
Second thing. Rulers should refer to text margin (left in LTR text, and right in RTL), not to page border. I would like things easier. There was a topic about this in the times of NWP beta, but to, so far, no apparent avail.
Cheers

Hiya Groucho

1) SPACE BEFORE PARA

What NWPro is doing, ignoring the space before at the top new pages, is correct to ensure your pages all start at the same level.

The DTP approach to get changes in the level at which pages start, e.g. on the first page of a new chapter, is to start a new section for a new chapter and have a different top margin for that page. You can do that in NWPro.

A workaround for you now is to put in a return at the top of the new page with the Level 1 head and give the Level 1 head a space before of 30 pts less the point size of that return (which you might set up as a separate style with your Level 1 head being the following style so that doing the return kicked in the Level 1 head). If you (can) do this, you would be guaranteed consistency.

If the Solanoids add a user defined means of activating before spacing at the top of new pages, I certainly hope the current suppression of it is left as the default.

2) MEASUREMENTS WITHIN THE TEXT SHOULD REFER TO THE TEXT MARGINS, NOT THE PAGE EDGE

You say

Rulers should refer to text margin (left in LTR text, and right in RTL), not to page border.

The rulers per se, including the vertical ruler when it finally appears -- and it really must -- should be zeroed at the appropriate page corner, the upper left for latin script which reads left-right, top-bottom.

Horizontal measurements within the text for tabs and left indents should refer to the left margin, i.e. that margin is zero. Outdents from indents can refer to the left margin OR be a negative with reference to the text margin set by the indent. Right indents must refer to the right margin, i.e. the right margin is zero and the indent is a positive number.

The current situation, where NWPro does both the left indent/outdent and right indent measurements correctly in the Style specification in the Style Sheet View, but shows left page edge measurements in both the Style Sheet View and in the Page View when you double click on the markers in the ruler to bring up the measurement dialog, is just bizarre.

Fixing this is a minor matter, surely! It ought to have been fixed long ago so that when you look at the measurements dialog you can set the actual measurements you have and can set the actual measurements you want within the text without having to do the arithmetic (which computers are so good at!) of adding/subtracting a constant, the page margin, for the left side measurements or doing the mental juggling to work out a right indent when the measurement given is from the left page edge.

Cheers, Geoff

Geoffrey Heard, Business Writer & Publisher

"Type & Layout: Are you communicating or just making pretty shapes" -- Revealed! The secrets of how you can use type and layout to turbocharge your messages in print. See the book at http://www.worsleypress.com

greenmorpher wrote:The DTP approach to get changes in the level at which pages start, e.g. on the first page of a new chapter, is to start a new section for a new chapter and have a different top margin for that page. You can do that in NWPro.

I quite agree with you as for the ruler issue. Now if you show me how do I set a different top margin for the first page in a section I will thank you very much. I dragged down top margin in a document, but all I got was that all top margins in that section dropped as well. I know the double return workaround (you can do the same by inserting the heading in a table, but I don't like ways aroung things), but it is queer I should do this.

Hiya Groucho

I was hoping you wouldn't ask this because I mislead you -- I was thinking of another program and I'm not at all sure it worked there either! In NWPro, you would have to make that first page a section on its own, then go to a new section on the next page, and so on for each chapter.

My apologies.

Personally, I would use the single blank return at the top of the page -- quicker and easier and it has the advantage that it can apply on any page.

Cheers, Geoff

Geoffrey Heard, Business Writer & Publisher

"Type & Layout: Are you communicating or just making pretty shapes" -- Revealed! The secrets of how you can use type and layout to turbocharge your messages in print. See the book at http://www.worsleypress.com

Blank return is OK, that is what I have been doing so far. But it is a workaround nonetheless. I hope people at Nisus will follow my suggestion and add that tiny checkbox.
Cheers, Henry.

Groucho wrote:Blank return is OK, that is what I have been doing so far. But it is a workaround nonetheless. I hope people at Nisus will follow my suggestion and add that tiny checkbox.
Cheers, Henry.

5 years later: there is still no honoring of 'space before' immediately after a section.

I'm having trouble like those in this thread, at the tops of new chapters, but also when I use sections that are 'same page' -- I want control of how much space there is in the next paragraph after the section used within a page. 'Space before' is the obvious control. It is disabled in NWP after sections. I don't agree. I want the preference choice to honor space after sections.

Steven Rowat

Thank you, Steven. You’re restoring hope. By the way, the ruler was finally fixed. That makes a nice fifty percent. of the requests.

Greetings, Henry.

Groucho wrote:You’re restoring hope. .

Greetings Henry,
Alas, we may never get more than hope on this one. So I'll note a cludge workaround I'm using (which you may have found): if I change the line spacing, instead of the 'before', I find that I can control spacing before, after a section. This is only good for titles or dividers other things that are on one line only, but at least for those it works.

Sure there are many ways. You can put the text into a one-cell table or in a text box, for example, and move the box around. Anyway, all of those methods are not straightforward. Well, let’s harp on the topic. Something will come out. I’m glad you revived it.

Henry.