NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

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eb303
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NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by eb303 » 2011-08-03 05:58:21

Hello all,

I've downloaded NWP v2 and tried it out, and I've noticed something annoying for me: I have scrollbars set to 'jump to here' mode in my system settings, but in NWP v2, they act as if the mode was 'jump to the next page'. I've tried to download the latest beta too, but no luck: Still the same wrong scrollbar behaviour. It is quite surprising, since they worked correctly in v1. What did happen? Why this change? I really like NWP, but I'm so used to my settings on my Mac that I'll probably have a hard time using it if it stays this way…

Thanks!
- Eric -

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martin
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by martin » 2011-08-03 11:33:50

Hi Eric- I just tried it out and using the system's "jump to the spot that's clicked" scrollbar setting works in NWP v2.x just fine for me. What version of OSX are you using? Do you have any software installed that enhances all your applications (eg: haxies)?

eb303
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by eb303 » 2011-08-03 23:42:40

Hello Martin, and thanks for your answer.

I'm on Leopard, 10.5.8 to be precise. I use the Mac for my work, so I didn't upgrade to the latest versions: As long as it works, you avoid doing anything that can break things… And I don't have any application enhancer at all, just the plain OS.
- Eric -

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martin
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by martin » 2011-08-04 13:27:40

It could be a problem with 10.5. I was testing on 10.6 and 10.7. If I can reproduce it on 10.5 I'll take a look and see if this might be something we can fix easily.

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by greenmorpher » 2011-08-04 14:57:24

Eric -- if you don't mind, just a friendly question. Why X.5.8? I've found upgrading to X.6.7 to b e all good. A couple of the earlier X.6.x versions had trouble with a couple of fonts, but that's been straightened out now. I'm intrigued.

I'm not upgrading to X.7 because I want to keep Rosetta, but I just can't see any downside to moving from X.5.8 to X.6.7. In fact, my favorite graphics program, Canvas X, worked significantly better on X.6.7 than it did on X.5.8.

Is there something I'm missing (or some others are missing)?

Cheers, geoff

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eb303
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by eb303 » 2011-08-05 00:05:42

@Martin: Thanks a lot. I'm actually ready to buy NWP, that was the only thing that kept me back. But if it's working on Snow Leopard and Lion, I guess I'll have to upgrade someday anyway, so nothing's keeping me now. Would love to have it working on Leopard too, as I'm probably stuck with it for some time…

@Geoff: It's not the OS itself that's keeping me back. I'm quite sure SL works without problem, it's been out for long enough now. The problem is that I have a few critical applications that might be problematic, typically virtualization software. I know I would have to switch to the next version for some of these, and I found out there were big problems for converting virtual machines from my version to the one supporting SL. And these VMs are quite critical for my work. So I won't switch, unless I'm forced to, or I would have to spend too long on getting things working again.
- Eric -

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by greenmorpher » 2011-08-05 14:21:40

Thanks Eric. Interesting and surprising. The Jobs man called X.6.x an update and said it was basically a cleaning up and consolidation of what had gone before and from the Canvas users' perspective, it was exactly that. Canvas X ran pretty well on X.5.x, but it got better -- pretty much to optimal -- with X.6.x. Canvas hadn't changed in four or five years so we concluded that what we had thought were Canvas bugs weren't Canvas bugs at all -- Canvas was carbonized to Apple's specs but then ran into Apple OS bugs which Jobsy and his mob had finally cleaned up in X.6.x.

Anyway -- history. I'll be running X.6.7 for the foreseeble future so as long as NWP keeps rtunning on it ... :D

Cheers, geoff

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by flafora » 2015-10-08 07:36:00

I am testing NWP 2.1.1 and have exactly the same problem. In System Preferences > General I have selected "Jump to the spot that's clicked" and the behaviahor in NWP is "Jump to next page". It does not happen in any other application.

My environment:
- Nisus Writer Pro 2.1.1
- OS X 10.11 (El Capitan)
- Mac Book Pro Retina late 2013

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by eb303 » 2015-10-08 07:54:47

Flafora's answer woke me up. :D Since my original post, I changed my Mac, I'm on an iMac with OS X 10.9 "Mavericks" now, and guess what? The problem is still happening: I have my scrollbar behaviour set to "jump to the spot that's clicked", but Nisus Writer Pro doesn't honour it, it still scrolls by one page. My version is the latest: 2.1.1

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by Þorvarður » 2015-10-08 15:14:16

eb303 wrote:I'm on an iMac with OS X 10.9 "Mavericks" now, and guess what? The problem is still happening: I have my scrollbar behaviour set to "jump to the spot that's clicked", but Nisus Writer Pro doesn't honour it, it still scrolls by one page.
Hi Eric,

first press and hold down the Option key, and then click. That will do the trick. :-)


My environment:
- Nisus Writer Pro 2.1.1
- OS X 10.10.5
- Mac Book Pro mid 2010

eb303
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by eb303 » 2015-10-08 23:41:27

Þorvarður wrote:first press and hold down the Option key, and then click. That will do the trick. :-)
Indeed, it does, thanks for the tip! Still quite unexpected though, the option key shouldn't be needed if that's the behaviour we've configured in our System Preferences… Ah well, I can live with that. :)

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martin
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by martin » 2015-10-09 15:13:26

eb303 wrote:
Þorvarður wrote:first press and hold down the Option key, and then click. That will do the trick. :-)
Indeed, it does, thanks for the tip! Still quite unexpected though, the option key shouldn't be needed if that's the behaviour we've configured in our System Preferences… Ah well, I can live with that. :)
It's as you say: the Option key should not be needed.

Initially I could not reproduce the problem you described– yet again. When I tested changing the OSX system preference to jump to the clicked spot worked perfectly. I used OSX 10.11 and NWP 2.1.2. But after some more testing I've found the circumstances that trigger the misbehavior.

If you change the system setting while NWP is running, it behaves properly. However, if you change your system preferences to jump to the clicked spot while NWP is not running, and then launch NWP, it will not obey the scrollbar preference. If you then "jiggle the handle" and toggle the system preference, NWP then takes notice.

It's a little strange, as the scrollbars are provided to NWP by Apple's system frameworks and largely operate automatically. But the problem doesn't seem to affect other apps I've tried, so NWP must be doing something to trigger the bug. Well, now that we can reproduce the bug, we'll investigate further and see what we can learn. Thank you!

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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by Þorvarður » 2015-10-11 13:52:09

martin wrote:If you change the system setting while NWP is running, it behaves properly.
Hi Martin,
In other words, toggling the the OSX system preference only corrects the misbehavior as long as Nisus stays open. If I quit Nisus and open it again, then it's back again. Seems as if Nisus suffers from some sort of Alzheimer's here. ;-)

Generally speaking, the Option key temporarily reverts the OSX system preference setting for the scrollbars. This is how it works in TextEdit, and that's the reason why the Option key can be used in Nisus as a workaround until the bug has been fixed.

The scrollbar in MS Word 2011, by the way, doesn't respect the OSX system preference at all—but who cares about MS Word anyhow,
except when we desperately need Split View. :( Split View is always the first question I'm asked when I recommend NWP to friends and colleagues. And when I say Nisus doesn't have split view, you should see their faces…!

So Martin, without further ado, please add my vote for split view to the feature-request-list.

Another feature request: An option to exclude line numbers from empty paragraphs, so that only lines with text will be numbered. Mellel can do that. :oops:

~ Þorvarður ~

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martin
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by martin » 2015-10-12 13:26:32

Þorvarður wrote:In other words, toggling the the OSX system preference only corrects the misbehavior as long as Nisus stays open. If I quit Nisus and open it again, then it's back again. Seems as if Nisus suffers from some sort of Alzheimer's here. ;-)
That's correct: the change is temporary. And I hope it's not Alzheimer's. Nisus Writer Pro is too young! :P

Thanks for your feature requests Þorvarður. I'll note them as necessary.

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ScottinPollock
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Re: NWP v2: Non-native scrollbars?

Post by ScottinPollock » 2017-09-14 02:47:24

martin wrote:Thanks for your feature requests Þorvarður. I'll note them as necessary.
Disheartening to discover it's been almost 2 years and this still has not been fixed in 2.1.7. @Martin, any idea when we can expect a fix?

macOS: 10.12.6 (16G29)


Thanks,

-SiP

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